The Basics of Science

"When you claim that atheists believe 'nothing created everything,' and that it is pitifully dishonest and stupid to believe that, you're making a complete and utter fool of yourself when the next sentence out of your mustachio'd mouth is that 'nothing created the creator who created everything,' and that there's absolutely nothing wrong whatsoever with believing that. How is that even different?" Nathaniel

Good question. It’s different in that it is the dimension of "time" that demands a beginning. If time didn’t exist there would be no beginning. Time is God’s creation and He dwells outside of its limits. He is eternal. Creation (the universe) dwells within the element of time (is temporal) and therefore had to have a beginning. It’s very simple.

"If you want to maintain that atheists truly do believe 'nothing created everything' (which we don't, but you don't care about that, do you?), then it absolutely does follow that you yourself believe that 'nothing created God,' who then proceeded to create everything else. If you want to claim that God always existed, then I will do exactly the same thing with the universe."

And in doing so you reveal that you don’t understand the basics of science. The Second Law of Thermodynamics shows that the universe cannot be eternal because it would have crumbled into dust (in time).

"This is what you do, Ray. You dismiss the scientific explanation as 'impossible' or 'ridiculous,' and the use the very same explanation when asked about your God. It's pathetic, Ray. You're pathetic."

The fact that I’m pathetic doesn’t change the fact that either you believe that nothing created this universe or you believe that something created it. You have no fence to sit upon. Either you are an atheist (believing that nothing created everything) and, as the Bible so aptly says, are a "fool' (see Psalm 14:1), or you believe that something created it and are therefore not an atheist.

I don't think that you are pathetic. I just think that you need to rethink your beliefs.